IRC log started Thu Apr 21 19:49:24 2005
pashdown	Hello and welcome everyone
_thermyte	Hello
pashdown	Its not quite 8:00 yet, but I thought we'd start anyway so the people using the web interface can actually see some conversation when they connect
pashdown	The last two chats were sparsely attended, so I'm glad to see a number of people here this time
pashdown	Does anyone want to throw out a question?
dapper	what's the latest word on your decision on a compaign manager? have you selected one yet?
pashdown	I've got a couple of people in mind inside the state, and so far I've been unable to make contact with anyone outside.
pashdown	My initial idea was to find someone who worked on Salazar's campaign in Colorado
pashdown	But my attempts to contact them have been met with no response
pashdown	I've been telling people that I'd like to find someone who has actually won some campaigns, but is willing to listen to my nontraditional ideas on campaigning.
dapper	I was given a question yesterday by a friend of mine; so if Matheson is definatly not running for senate next year, does that make you the only democratic candidate? and if so does the democratic party have to officially validate you as their candidate?
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pashdown	The Utah Democrats won't validate me until the convention in 2006, so far I am the only candidate.
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pashdown	Every candidate would like to avoid a party challenge
A|home	any rumblings from others that might run?
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pashdown	I talked to Bill Orton in January and he expressed interest then, but I haven't heard anything since.
pashdown	Aside from the Tribune mentioning his name.
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_thermyte	I would like more information on your nontraditional campaigning. I am very optimistic about your chances against Hatch, but he has really got a strong root system. How do you plan on approaching this?
pashdown	I heard Meg Holbrook, past Dem chair was considering if nobody else was willing to do it.
pashdown	I believe a lot can be accomplished over the Internet of course.
pashdown	On the campaigns I've worked on in the past,
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pashdown	there has been a lot of focus on fund raising.  I don't negate its importance, but I think a *lot* of volunteers are alienated by it.
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pashdown	That is, they'd like to come talk to the candidate, but it is almost *always* $50 "suggested" to get in the door.
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pashdown	I'd rather tell people to go to the website or send me a check if they're interested in donating.
pashdown	Then hold events for actually talking and meeting people.
pashdown	A lot of the "events" part will depend on volunteers in cities throughout Utah.
dapper	that makes a chat room like this a very common ground for discussion
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dapper	how important is the southern utah vote going to end up being for your campaign?
pashdown	Yeah, and in spite of the use of the Internet in the Presidential campaigns, I still haven't seen it exploited fully.
evan	pashdown, i don't think that in utah it's worth spending much time on
evan	the internet, that is
pashdown	Evan, but at least for organizing I think it is.
EricB	actually UT is pretty wired
pashdown	southern utah...
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pashdown	Looking at past numbers, I will probably need 400K votes to pull it off.
evan	pashdown, absolutely
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pashdown	Paul Van Damm and Scott Howell did about 150K in Salt Lake County
pashdown	I think through XMission's image here, I can probably do better than that
pashdown	So rural Utah is half of the vote
EricB	word of mouth and free events will help
pashdown	Yes
EricB	in addition to a regular campaign
pashdown	I've also been dismayed at many campaigns focus on Salt Lake County, rural Utah gets frequently ignored by the Democrats.
pashdown	So I think just getting out there will have a lot of value, but I still need a network in cities I am planning on going to.
A|home	well alot of that is due to lack of support for dem candidates in rural utah
EricB	the trick then will be how to address rural UT
_thermyte	I like your idea about meeting with people more. I think the more time you can spend actually meeting with people the better, especially if it is not tied to an expectation of a donation.
OldFoolS	well do you honestly believe that rural utah is worth spending a lot of time and energy on?
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pashdown	If its 50% of the vote, I think it is.
OldFoolS	I guess I should rephrase
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dapper	it seems to me that it may even be more important than spending energy on metro salt lake.  metro salt lake already seems to swing the democratic way (at least more than rual utah)
OldFoolS	do you think it's worth spending a lot of time and energy on if so much of the vote is already going to the other side and there is little hope of people actually voting outside of party lines?
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pashdown	one second, i have to go answer the door
EricB	I think rural ut is close knit, if you offend one you risk offending all
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dapper	since rual utah seems to be harder to swing towards a democratic vote, and they are 50% of the states votes, then it'd be most important to campaign hard down there
pashdown	ok
Clarity	Busy room! Hi Pete - sorry I'm late!
pashdown	welcome clarity
pashdown	back to the rural utah question
A|home	does anyone know of a map of utah counties and how they voted in the fall 2004 presidential election?
pashdown	I like to give Utahns more credit than always being "straight party" tickets
pashdown	I'd like to think that meeting and talking with them can go a long way
EricB	face time is very important
OldFoolS	you run the risk of preaching to the choir
evan	pashdown what do you anticipate your budget to be? where will that money come from?
Clarity	A|Home - I don't know but I know the Native American community voted 90% Kerry and the county where Moab is (name escapes me) went to Kerry too
pashdown	OF: You mean pandering?
OldFoolS	well, the people that are most likely to show up to your events are the ones most likely to vote for you
OldFoolS	not to say it isn't important
pashdown	Maybe so, but much of the Bush campaign was won by volunteers going door to door.
EricB	if you recall the quote from the tribune, Hatch isn't running against anybody, he's running for re-election
handz	http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/elections/2004/ut/prescounties/
pashdown	If volunteers can drag some of the republicans to the events then maybe some hearts can be swayed.
EricB	it makes it sound like he has it in the bag
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pashdown	On the budget question
pashdown	Hatch raised $5M in 2000
handz	that url is for you A|home
EricB	yes he raised $5M but how many people got to meet him?
pashdown	much of this campaign hinges on the bet that there are enough angry people in the US *on the Internet specifically* that there is a potential for fundraising there
A|home	http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/pages/results/states/UT/P/00/index.html | http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/pages/results/states/UT/G/00/index.html | http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/pages/results/states/UT/S/01/index.html
EricB	paypal could work
OldFoolS	pashdown: A question on an issue, how do you feel about the recent attacks on the judiciary by some members of government?
pashdown	I can't remember who it was recently who was saying Justice Kennedy should be "removed" and not in a very nice way.
* evan/#pashdown <3's activist judges
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EricB	or a generic "insert credit card here" donation form.
pashdown	The ironic thing I found about that is that Kennedy was appointed by Reagan
OldFoolS	Do you support increased scrutiny of the judiciary's powers and the decisions they make?
pashdown	Increased scrutiny of any of the branches is always a good thing, but some of the rhetoric that has been spouted recently is just over the edge.
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A|home	what do you plan on doing to try and get votes in Utah county?
pashdown	one more thing about the judges
pashdown	I think the judiciary process in this country is very solid
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A|home	Utah County 2004 election results: Huntsman 73% | Bennett 84% | Bush 86%
pashdown	Utah county I think is probably the toughest nut to crack.  I hope there is a large enough technical base there that it will help.
pashdown	I can probably make good inroads in Davis County because I'm from there.
EricB	besides the net and some events, what's the theme of the campaign?
pashdown	There is also a lot of conservatives who aren't really happy with Hatch.
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pashdown	Eric, I'd have to say being in touch is the primary theme I want to put forth.
EricB	so a friendly approachable theme, "do it for pete's sake"
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Clarity	LOL love it
A|home	true, but I don't think that the conservatives that are informed are the ones that are 1) in the majority and 2) most likely to vote for hatch
pashdown	Well my wife has been pushing the "Pioneer" theme, and once the bio hits the web page you'll understand why.
* jsmith/#pashdown will vote for pashdown
EricB	you did pioneer one of the largest ISPs in UT
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EricB	and you're big on privacy
pashdown	That and I have a family history of it.
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jsmith	And were a pioneer when it came to letting customers help chose the music-on-hold!
Clarity	I like it
pashdown	Yes, I think privacy is a big issue.  I'd like to think that nuclear testing is also important.
jsmith	s/chose/choose/
pashdown	Van Damm hammered nuclear testing though, and it really didn't do much for his numbers.
Clarity	I am so glad to hear that Pete
_thermyte	This may be a bad question, but what is the likelyhood that you will do some kind of television commercial? People really respond well to that and if it is done well, you can reach a lot of people that would otherwise not have even heard of you. I haven't seen any such commercials and am not sure if there is a reason this isn't done...
A|home	_thermyte: one reason they are not as popular is the price
A|home	but yes they are effective
pashdown	commercial: depends on money, but there is also the possibility of just doing some viral stuff to start
EricB	I remember you telling me once that you'd shut Xmission down before letting the FBI install Carnivore, you care that mouch about your customers and it powerful
jsmith	pashdown: What's your stance on regulation and taxes in the VoIP arena -- I mean, there's obviously gotta be a balance between openness and having emergency services, etc.  Where do you stand.
Clarity	The privacy issue goes far for all Utahns
pashdown	I think its impossible to regulate VoIP
* jsmith/#pashdown can't seem to type any question marks in his questions :-(
pashdown	If you regulate something on the Internet, what is to stop its immediate replacement by unregulated data?
_thermyte	pashdown: what do you mean when you say "viral stuff"?
pashdown	Emergency services with VoIP is a whole other ball of wax.
pashdown	Thermyte: make a self-depreciating/funny video then email it out
EricB	there should be a services regulation, for 911
pashdown	Then expect other people will pass it on
_thermyte	gotcah
_thermyte	thats a great idea
pashdown	EricB, yeah but you'd need to regulate the underlying layer too right?
pashdown	If your cable/dsl goes down, what then?
pashdown	Vint Cerf talked about horizontal regulation when he was here, which is something I need to study more.
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Claudius	pete, how do you feel about the right to life?
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EricB	well that follows under "act of god" stuff
Claudius	(not that that is a major thing for me)
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EricB	like lightning in your home insurance
pashdown	in regards to abortion or living will?
Claudius	both
A|home	I'd like to hear your view on both
Clarity	Or care for those alive
Claudius	but living will is more on everyone's front burner these days
pashdown	let me hit the hot button first
A|home	but abortion is a very touchy subject in utah
_thermyte	I just feel that a lot of the people you are going to reach, already have your vote, there are a lot of people out there that only have two media sources; church and television. I feel that this accounts for a very damaging amount of hatch voters
pashdown	the standard utah democrat line is that abortion is between a woman, her husband, her doctor, and her faith
Claudius	nah, there's enuf people tired of hatch's crap
jsmith	_thermyte: I'd tend to disagree with that
Claudius	heheh.. the "utah" democrat - nice cover
pashdown	the other line is that abortion should be legal, safe, and rare
jsmith	_thermyte: I have yet to hear any talk of Hatch at church, and I'm there every Sunday
EricB	maybe you can phrase it her faith, her husband and her doc
Claudius	ok... and the pete line is.................
pashdown	i agree with the latter
EricB	since UT has a religious bias
pashdown	now in regards to end of life
Martel	Speaking of religion, what did you think of the SL Trib article about your campaign?
Claudius	eww....
* Claudius/#pashdown goes hunting for the Trib article in question
pashdown	steve, next in line, hang on a sec ;-)
pashdown	living wills are obviously very important
pashdown	so important that it may be wise of states to start considering it like a donor system and doing some sort of sentiment checking with id issuing
pashdown	if there is no living will, then i think its the guardian's decision
Claudius	should we spend money like the shaivo case?  or can we protect Utah from having that issue?
_thermyte	jsmith: I am not saying that hatch is praised at church, I am just saying that he is of the most dominant religion in utah and for people that dont read the news and their main influence is television, this is enough for them. From my experiance, I see that for a lot of people, tv is one of the best ways to reach them
pashdown	i think the schiavo case was an absolute travesty and tragedy
EricB	won't that fall under the typical democratic "bigger gov't" theme that the conservatives will hammer you on?
pashdown	and i think nobody on the outside has the right to judge either side
EricB	the id thing i mean
Claudius	pete, how old are you if you don't mind me asking?
pashdown	by "judge" i mean second guess motivations
pashdown	claudius 38
pashdown	now on the religion question, what was interesting about that article is what i said that they didn't print
A|home	anyone find said article?
pashdown	A, its linked on my home page
Martel	http://www.sltrib.com/search/ci_2621491
pashdown	i consider myself a spiritual person.  there have been a few of those moments in my life that i can't explain to anything else.
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pashdown	i believe in the philosophy of jesus, but i also think what buddha said was important, and there is much to be learned from other cultures
pashdown	my issue with the theocracy is that many of our leaders use religion as a shield
* Claudius/#pashdown wonders wth is meant by "largest EXISTING ISP"
pashdown	to the effect of "i am infallible by the result of god being on my side"
pashdown	i think that is incredibly presumptuous and i'm tired of hearing it
Clarity	Amen to that (heheh)
pashdown	eric you had a question about id's
A|home	pashdown: what is your thoughts on the battle between the University of Utah and The State of Utah in regards to the guns on campus issue?
EricB	no i mean creating an ID system for living will will creat bigger gov't
Martel	I completely agree with the shield analogy--in fact it seems that "the shield" is used as often as not to cover over the truth. But in an extremely religious state, perhaps you should avoid hyperbolic terms like "theocracy."
pashdown	i don't think that recording a person's sentiments about end of life is an expansion of government
EricB	something the republicans will hammer on
pashdown	again, compare it to the organ donor system
pashdown	martel you are right
Claudius	it could very well be an extension to the organ donor system and use that infrastructure
EricB	yes organ donation is on all licenses, they'd have to be reissued to include a living well section
EricB	more $$$ down the drain
pashdown	i used theocracy that day because i heard a republican representative from connecticut using the same word and it was on my mind
EricB	IDK maybe a sticker on the back would suffice
pashdown	btw, he wasn't positive about it either
pashdown	eric, not reissued, just added for new licenses
pashdown	but that is really a state and not a federal issue
pashdown	so was the schiavo case though
EricB	what do you think about a national ID that the Dept. of homeland security is pushing?
Clarity	Pete, I'd like to hear your take on the media today - with so much consolidation, the air waves don't seem to be that of the people anymore. What are your thoughts?
EricB	and that they could force states to redesign licenses and include privacy hotbuttons like RFID?
pashdown	i think its redundant, it would seem to me that linking drivers licenses/passports/state-id would be more immediately useful
pashdown	rfid first, then media
A|home	wait
A|home	U of U and guns :)
pashdown	ok, thats third
Clarity	I'll wait :)
pashdown	i've carried an RFID chip around in my wallet for the past 8 or so years
pashdown	i think the RFID debate is not entirely valid because you need access to the database to correlate the number to anything
* Claudius/#pashdown wonders if Pete's scared of the radiation from the RFID? :)
pashdown	i have to laugh about the RFID in passports
Muti	I thought the passport RFID was going to store personal information
EricB	but what if they are included in passports and licenses
pashdown	well they make it out like you can suddenly identify Americans by RFID
pashdown	i just got back from Mexico, and believe me, its pretty damn easy to identify Americans
EricB	every encryption is only secure for so long before it is broken
EricB	lol
Claudius	especially TALL white americans
pashdown	yeah, but all RFID does is cough out a number
pashdown	if they beat me with a stick and take the passport off my neck, they can get the same number
Muti	'But instead of simply saying "Polo," the 64 Kb chip will say the passport holder's name, address, date and place of birth, and send along a digital photograph.'
Muti	from wired.com
pashdown	on the other hand, i don't think RFID is necessary for passports
pashdown	muti, then that is bad
Muti	http://www.wired.com/news/privacy/0,1848,65412,00.html
EricB	but what's to stop walmart from sniffing your license and saying you were in the store
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A|home	I need to duck out early, I will be back on later and will look for your answer to the UofU gun issue online or in my scroll log.
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pashdown	walmart needs access to the drivers license database if its just the number
pashdown	ok A
EricB	that get that from check you write
pashdown	i would be against broadcasting any "extra" information
pashdown	good point eric, and credit cards too
EricB	si :-) ok i'm done with rfid
pashdown	ok, on media consolidation
pashdown	i think its a bad thing, but its also quite unstoppable
Clarity	Damn, you think it's too late to get the FCC to change the rules?
pashdown	it may get to the point where its busted up, but i don't hold out any optimism that you can do anything about it until then
Clarity	Thank God for the Internet...
pashdown	my point exactly
pashdown	the only radio stations i listen to anymore are the ones xmission sponsors
Clarity	Thanks Pete
pashdown	i think the market will find other ways around conglomerates
Clarity	You may like listening to airamericaradio.com
EricB	unless you're a blogger and can get fired for voicing your opinions about your job
pashdown	eric, i think thats pretty pathetic
EricB	a big BOO for KALL
pashdown	i'm big on the corporate responsibility thing of course, but that is also difficult to legislate
Clarity	Especially when the corporations own the representatives
pashdown	agreed
pashdown	in regards to A's question about guns at the university
EricB	the ones i've see are "queenofsky" where she complained about her job (at delta) and was quickly fired w/o ever mentioning delta
Claudius	she was doing things on the job she shouldnt have been doing, that was why she was fired
pashdown	aside from the fact that this is a state issue, i think the debate over "guns at X" could be quickly resolved by attempting to pass state legislation removing the metal detectors at the capitol
Claudius	haha... that's too true
EricB	guns are impossible to control because of the constitution, the NRA, and crooks
pashdown	if the u or a church or a business wants to not have guns on the premises, i think that is reasonable
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pashdown	however, in regards to gun control
EricB	if you take away guns, then only the crooks will have them
pashdown	i feel that i shift from the democrats on that issue, because i think its a personal responsibility issue
* Claudius/#pashdown thinks if he keeps listening to pete, he may be a democratic convert
pashdown	i don't think things like armor-piercing bullets are necessary for joe q public to have though
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EricB	yes like hunting with an AK47
Claudius	do u own a gun pete?
pashdown	no, my wife would shoot me if i did
pashdown	i grew up shooting them though
Claudius	hehehe
pashdown	i find it a bit incredible that my parents let me go out with a .22 when i was about 10 years old
pashdown	i used to shoot cans across a gulley with it
kenny	times have changed since then though
Claudius	did u kill or hurt anyone?  rest my case
EricB	but it sounds like a "sign of the times" issue
Martel	Hey, I lived downstream of that gulley!
Claudius	they trusted you because you were personally responsible
pashdown	hooray for gulleys!
kenny	ya, parents stopped being parents and mom and dad were replaced with tv
Clarity	hahaha
EricB	HA bloodhound gang reference
Claudius	wouldn't it be fun to shoot cans offa the Huntsman dome at the UofU? :o
pashdown	i suppose if i lived in an area as vacated as bountiful was at the time, i would let my son have a rifle eventually
pashdown	but that doesn't really fly very well on capitol hill
* Claudius/#pashdown wonders if that was a slam on Bountiful
EricB	so how do you keep people responsible?
pashdown	no, i miss bountiful of the 70's
pashdown	eric i don't think there is any way to
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Web812	hello.  anyone else chatting?
EricB	i agree which is why gun control is almost impossible to achieve
pashdown	yes
pashdown	eric i presume you own guns?
EricB	hell no
pashdown	claudius?
pashdown	anyone?
EricB	I used to own a bow, that's it for weapons if you count the old nintendo gun
pashdown	yeah i have more than my share of "light guns"
pashdown	a funny thing about the rural utah issue
pashdown	there is a guy in richfield i've done business with
Clarity	I have a gun
Clarity	Rather my husband does
pashdown	he's a great guy and a total outdoorsman
_thermyte	I am intimidated to own a gun, too much power in one place, I don't hunt, and don't think that pulling a gun on someone to defend myself really makes anything better, but you can never get rid of guns, the technology is here
Clarity	I've never touched it
pashdown	the first time i went down to see him, they had all these rifle shells on the floor of his office
EricB	problems at the office eh?
pashdown	he was probably one of the last people i'd expect to throw his support behind my campaign
twyst3d	hehe
pashdown	but he surprised me by being one of the first to email his support to me
EricB	i think it's because he knows you like a lot of us do, you're fair
pashdown	much to my surprise he told me the main issue with rural utah as he sees it is the economy and children moving away
EricB	<brown nose>
Clarity	that's terrific. I am on your side on the gun issue as well (though they personally scare me silly - my husband loves to drive out to the desert and shoot cans - he couldn't do that in Holland)
pashdown	ha ha
pashdown	i like to shoot cans too, but i don't have the stomach to kill anything
EricB	agricultural economy? jobs? in rural ut?
Clarity	He doesn't either (thank God)
Clarity	Pete, have you read "Don't Think of an Elephant" by Lakoff?
pashdown	i think there is a lot of possibility in rural areas of the country if you have better education systems, and better transportation systems
pashdown	Clarity, yes ;-)
pashdown	i think a lot of people would like to live in a rural area if they could get to the city for work quickly
EricB	i'm thinking more and more you should really hit up the rural areas
pashdown	rural-sourcing is also a great idea that the internet helps make possible
Claudius	pete: yes I own several pistols and rifles and enjoy shooting
EricB	yes commuter rail, but we had federal funds for trax
pashdown	Claudius, do you think there are any lines in what a person should be able to own?
EricB	from the olympics
pashdown	i think the entire country needs a transportation overhaul
pashdown	do we really need to wait to bail out the airlines again?
Claudius	heck yeah - military style weapons are a little much for private ownership
_thermyte	canada has as many guns as us, and they dont have near as many gun related deaths, I dont think control really means much
EricB	personally i don't know how they stay in business in the first place
pashdown	trax?
EricB	airlines
pashdown	ah yeah
EricB	trax is subsidied a bit from what i hear, but it also makes smart use of technology
* Claudius/#pashdown wonders if pete can put a face with his nickname?
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pashdown	how so?
Web019	Hello ther Pete
pashdown	hello
pashdown	Was there another question that I missed?
EricB	how so what?
pashdown	face/nickname
pashdown	i presume we've met Claudius ;-)
Web019	This is Chalres Kimball Former 2cd Vice Chair Salt Lake County Dems
Clarity	Charles!!!
Web019	Hi Clarity
* Clarity/#pashdown waves
pashdown	Hello Charles and welcome to the chat
Web019	How goes it Mr. Candidate
pashdown	great, i've had a real good set of questions tonight
pashdown	martel are you still on?
Martel	I am.
pashdown	can you give me an idea what the makeup of illinois is? because someone was saying that it was similar to utah, and that barak would have had the same struggles reaching out to the non-metro areas.
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Web019	Pete, currently the dems that are in office parade about with an air of entitlement while getting llittle done.  If elected, an I pray(I don't often pray) you do, how will you go about reinvigorating?
pashdown	I think one of my primary advantages as a candidate is that I'm not a bred politician.
pashdown	I didn't go to law school.  I haven't run for anything else.
pashdown	However, I am initimate with state politics and getting things done.
pashdown	intimate
Clarity	And you've helped the party with web help - I think that's wonderful
pashdown	A lot of people want to know how I think I can "solve" a multitude of issues.
pashdown	I don't have all the solutions, but I think I have a better approach to finding solutions.
EricB	i don't think you can solve, just steer them in the right direction
Martel	Outside of Chicago I think it is a lot like Utah. An awful lot of people seem to base their judgments on flash-point issues like abortion, school prayer, gun control, etc. And that holds true to a certain extent even in Urbana-Champaign. The real reason Barak did so well in non-Metro Illinois is that he was running agains Alan Keyes.
pashdown	I didn't go to school to be an MBA, but I managed to beat all the dozens of other businesses run by MBAs.
pashdown	I think the same goes for politics.
pashdown	Martel, for an empty seat too.
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pashdown	A lot of the odds against me are calculated on the fact that incumbants have a 98% reelection rate.
pashdown	Also the "reddest" of the "red states" doesn't help either.
Claudius	but this incumbant is a moron which werks in yer favor! :)
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Web019	That is true, yet anyone who follows politics either local or national clearly understand that there is a lack of true leadership.  What people need to understand is that it is not only about this election, it is about a ling term vision for the future.  I don't think that the candidate should solve the issues of the day, I do believe that they should at least have the courage to speak their mind.  So with that in mind, what is your stance on social securit
EricB	lol
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pashdown	I want to run on my own strengths instead of as an attack dog against the opposition.
EricB	yes don't mudsling, it just makes you look bad too
pashdown	Charles, i think Social Security can be fixed with a few small adjustments and not privatization.
Web019	Claudius, Senator Hatch is no Moron, we may disagree with him but he is one very formidiable man
Clarity	There are so many issues all Utahns should agree on - I think you can run a positive campaign so long as you frame the debate
pashdown	I think Medicare is something that requires more attention.
Claudius	I agree he's not a moron..... but I sure am tired of the hi and mighty attitude he exudes
pashdown	I'm also very tired of the health insurance situation in the country.
Claudius	and I have met and spoken with him personally
Web019	That is true Clarity, any candidate running must retake the termininolgy debate
pashdown	I pay about $13K a month for healt insurance for XMission employees.
Martel	I don't know if you think that raising the term-limit issue is mudslinging, but I know a lot of conservatives who are big term-limit advocates.
EricB	I'm most interested in the health care area and needless baseless lawsuits
Clarity	WOW
Clarity	Again, something ALL Utahns should be in agreement on.
EricB	that just jack up the price for everybody
pashdown	Martel, everyone who is experienced in campaigning tells me that term-limits are a loser issue.
Claudius	health care is my main concern
Web019	No what raises the cost of insurance is the cost that we as tax payers contribute to cover  the unisured.
Martel	No way!
EricB	OBGYN's are fading away because of malpractice insurance rates
pashdown	One person told me that you have to force people to a choice when they hit the voting booth.
pashdown	That comes down to one issue that you think is going to resonate.
Claudius	I see no reason we cannot all participate in a single health care plan similar to what the Federal Employees have if we have no other insurace alternatives
pashdown	I don't think term limits is it.
pashdown	Claudius I agree.
Claudius	different levels of insurace as we can afford to play more
Claudius	ok.. PAY more
pashdown	I think state and possibly national cooperatives would be nice to buy into.
Claudius	mmm... state by state would be good
pashdown	In spite of what I pay for insurance at XMission, there has been many times that the policy has refused to pay out.
Clarity	Single health care plan - YES. They do this in Holland and still give private insurance a chance to compete - I think that could work here too
pashdown	Really?
Claudius	but a US plan would help keep costs lower - (with lots of red tape - like medicare/medicaid)
pashdown	Its a government healthcare plan?
Web019	We pay it no matter what, so what should be taking place is a dialogue on how do we include all under some sort of umbrella program.  That program could or should include well checks aand basic health care.  Then ther ecould be three or four different levels that citizens could buy into depending on ability.  However lets all agree tha tit is a shame that 47 million americans live in fear with no health care.  I know, I am self imployed and I am one of them
EricB	I think healthcare should be a quasi-public venture like utopia
Clarity	That was my experience - they have a plan to cover everyone, but if you want more coverage, you pay for that (or your job does) and you have a choice to which plan
pashdown	Charles, not to mention the number of people who would like to start their own businesses but they can't get insurance away from their jobs.
pashdown	Bad for economic growth.
Clarity	good point
Web019	that is true cobra health care is a joke
EricB	when you pay $300 just for pills in your 30's healthcare is always on your mind
pashdown	I would like to do everything I can to support people in starting small businesses.
pashdown	I think that small business owners have a better grip on ethics than large, and serve the community better.
EricB	ys but insurance for small business is super expensive
Web019	Pete I am sure that you are well aware of the brain drain taking place in this country
pashdown	which should be changed
pashdown	^insurance
_thermyte	Web019: I agree, I think everyone needs to benefit from health care, it is a basic and essential need for everyone
pashdown	brain drain, yes
pashdown	i talked with an old professor of mine about that this last week
_thermyte	when you say brain drain, is that the same as the anti-intellectual movement?
Web019	Here in Utah the is a loss of intellectual capital from people leaving due to quality of life issues and cost of living
Web019	no
EricB	which is why I think the gov't needs to reign in control of the heathcare system that has now spiraled out of control
Clarity	Persuit of Life (health insurance), Liberty (dump the patriot act), and persuit of happiness (equal chance for all)
pashdown	the lack of qualified engineers and scientists entering the field in the US really worries me
EricB	yes we produce more lawyers than engineers
Web019	we don't encourage peopel to enter in to those fields.  it is as if to do so is anti christian
pashdown	there are a couple of pictures on my website of my kids at mirikan
pashdown	i went there last year and was amazed, its tokyo's science museum
Web019	I remember your children for the fundraiser at the palace
Web019	from
pashdown	aside by being utterly illuminating, it was totally devoid of corporate sponsorship
pashdown	and like $5 to get in
Claudius	Utah needs to have a brain drain
pashdown	Utah is having a brain drain
Web019	No Utah needs leadership
pashdown	look at novell going to massachussets
Claudius	too many peeps willing to werk in Utah to be close to the church and werk for minimum wage
Claudius	:o
EricB	and iomega going to CA (i think)
* Claudius/#pashdown looks at the pot calling the kettle black :o
OldFoolS	Utah is like a mecca for genetics research tho
Web019	There is failure on the part of our elected officails to stand by there convictions and engage in a meaningful dialogue
pashdown	but even the life-sciences is starting to float to california with the governator's initiative on stem-cell research
pashdown	and overseas to places that are more friendly to science like korea
Web019	Get the citizens some truth and let them decide, don't frame the debate with simple catch phrases and cool tshirts
OldFoolS	that's a pretty small sector of current research though
Martel	What do you think you can do about the brain drain, though?
EricB	do you think research park need to be revialized
pashdown	OF: yes, but i think its something we need to hold onto tightly
Martel	My reaction would be simply to teach more Latin!
pashdown	as well as promote utah's tech base
* Claudius/#pashdown thinks web019 has just described Senator Hatch's strengths pretty well
Web019	the brain drain is a great concern to me, to allow it to continue is to allow a further eroding of our economic infrastructure
pashdown	Martel, you'll be happy to know that my kids have been accepted into a school that teaches Latin.
OldFoolS	RHSM?
pashdown	Choir School of the Madeleine
Martel	Fortunati sunt!
OldFoolS	I took Latin for a year
OldFoolS	it was awful
pashdown	heh
pashdown	Martel teaches
dg	Pax Pashdowna!
OldFoolS	"I saved Latin, what did you ever do?"
EricB	the only latin i know is on the back of money :-)
pashdown	Martel, why couldn't they find anyone else aside from Alan Keyes?
Web019	Clarity
Clarity	yes? Sorry - on the phone with Craig now too
slack	rushmore!
Web019	Hi to Craig
pashdown	hooray
Clarity	:)
_rocky_	pashdown: corporate sponsorship is something i wanted to ask about. i hated it in highschool, 4 pepsi machines in every hall, text books talking about nabisco(c) cookies, or the speed of a Ferrari(t), pizza hut and subway the only real food in the cafeteria.  what is your opinion on coporations sneaking their messages into public schools?
pashdown	i've got to cut things off after this last question, kids have to be put in bed
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EricB	yes and don't for get "Channel One"
Web019	it is a crime
pashdown	rocky, i am so very against that
dweeHH	rocky: didn't you like having subway for lunch?
Clarity	Thanks for this Pete - great idea
EricB	c-ya pete
pashdown	i think the schools should toss the bad nutrition vendors out on their behinds
Web019	Pete thank you for your time and i have aprivate question for you
Claudius	I hope this will be a regular thing
pashdown	come back next week!
Claudius	even AFTER you are elected
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Clarity	yes!
pashdown	my first promise claudius
dweeHH	just look at jared
dweeHH	i mean sure he had aides as well
pashdown	thanks all
dweeHH	but subway can't be that bad nutrionally
pashdown	charles email me your question please
_rocky_	yeah, but to a vegetarian like me, the meatie mc meaty sub wasn't a good option ;)
Web019	Clarity your you give Pete my contact info so tha ti mught have him call me.
Clarity	you bet
Web019	Thanks
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dweeHH	heh, fuckin italian bmt
Web019	Pete thank you for your time,  now i must finish my post convention letter to the delegates
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pashdown	np
pashdown	tima/jenn we're just wrapping things up
dweeHH	pashdown for senate
dweeHH	is the important bit
dweeHH	i think
Web019	Thank you Clarity good night and peace to all
IRC log ended Thu Apr 21 21:33:37 2005

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